Sicce SDC 7.0 Pump connection to Kraken Force Port 24v

[johnadouglas]

I just finished switching two tanks over to two Krakens this past weekend and I want to thank all of you - all of your posts have been very helpful in understanding what to expect. In my case both tanks are Red Sea with Red Sea pumps, skimmers, wave, etc, but I use SICCE for UV and utility (sump agitation, feeders) purposes. If I can answer any questions from anyone attempting something similar I'm happy to do so.

Everything came over fine after making/mimicking the power cables *except* the 12V Red Sea ATO. Just FYI even though the cable and power were fine as soon as I plugged the ATO cable into the Kraken my GFCI tripped and the whole tank shut off, of course. I tested and isolated (same issue happens when plugged into an X4 drive connector) and can only surmise that the temperature or water level pins on the RS ATO are looping in some how and creating the fault. So I still have one tiny brick, but the rest is a dream come true.

Question - has anyone ever determined if it was possible to connect 24V to the Battery port (2x 12V in Series) so that in an outage the 24V only equipment could continue to run? Thanks again.

 

[Sole83]

To connect the Sicce SDC 7.0 to the Kraken 24V force port, use a 4-pin screw-type M16 connector and match each pin from the pump to the Kraken port. This will provide power only, so you still control the pump via the Sicce app or Hydros integration. Make sure the jumper wires are the correct gauge for safety.

 

[JeffB418]

Question - has anyone ever determined if it was possible to connect 24V to the Battery port (2x 12V in Series) so that in an outage the 24V only equipment could continue to run? Thanks again.

No, the battery port does NOT support anything over like 15V. You can't use dual batteries.

However there is a DIY option of using boosters that take in 12V OR 24V and always produce 24V. Just note that using one of these has a ripple effect on current draw when in 12V mode. Basically current will DOUBLE to make up for voltage being cut in half. You just need to take that into account and make sure you dont exceed the force port MAX plus the battery port MAX. See it explained here:

Thread 'DIY Guide: 24V Jebao Pumps on Kraken Battery'

Oct 25, 2023

This DIY tutorial shows you how to run some Jebao 24V pumps on a Kraken Force Port AND be able to take advantage of battery mode (12V). Note: this is a DIY method and please understand everything in this guide before attempting, failure to do so could damage your equipment. Coralvue, nor I, take any responsibility. Got it? Ok good, proceed.

Background: Many Jebao pumps and powerheads run off 24V and can be directly powered off a Hydros Kraken Force Port (24V) with currently available adapter cables. But if you are using a battery with the Kraken, Hydros will only provide 12V on a...

• JeffB418
• Replies: 8
• Forum: DIY HYDROS

• 

 

[johnadouglas]

Extremely helpful thank you very much.

 

[KenS]

So I am going to replace Kraken with a new on that CS sent & I was given this procedure to follow.

HYDROS Control - Replace Device

Replacing a HYDROS device in a collective is very easy. Here is a quick how-to!

www.coralvuehydros.com

The question I have is that it see at some point I will need to have both devices connected to the collective with CB cables, which I don't think I have one long enough. My Kraken is mounted & it seems I need to plug in the new one, connect it to wifi, then connect CB, then add it to the collective, transfer settings, then clear settings on the old one, remove it from my account, disconnect the CB from it. Is this all correct? The problem again is I don't have a CB long enough to have both Krakens connected to the collective at the same time. Any suggestions?

 

[Danny]

So I am going to replace Kraken with a new on that CS sent & I was given this procedure to follow.

HYDROS Control - Replace Device

Replacing a HYDROS device in a collective is very easy. Here is a quick how-to!

www.coralvuehydros.com

The question I have is that it see at some point I will need to have both devices connected to the collective with CB cables, which I don't think I have one long enough. My Kraken is mounted & it seems I need to plug in the new one, connect it to wifi, then connect CB, then add it to the collective, transfer settings, then clear settings on the old one, remove it from my account, disconnect the CB from it. Is this all correct? The problem again is I don't have a CB long enough to have both Krakens connected to the collective at the same time. Any suggestions?

How long a cable do you need?

 

[KenS]

So, I actually found a 6ft cable which is long enough to do the swap.

But now I'm thinking why go thought all of that? I literally only have two 24V force ports in use one running a Varios for my skimmer & another powering my 4 bank doser.. Can't I just i just clear all settings on old Kraken, remove from account, replace with new Kraken, add to collective & set up two new "Constant" inputs? Seems easier & faster?

 

[KenS]

Ok, did the swap. It was easy enough. Old Kraken is reset & deleted off the collective, new Kraken is installed & added & both Sicce 7.0 pumps are up & running! No on, off, on, off. They are both running fine for 1hr+ now and hopefully for good!

Just wow! It sure appears I had a bad Kraken all along. Thanks to the 2 gentleman that came in after I failed & tried the mod anyway. So glad it worked for them, and that inspired me to get to the bottom of why I couldn't get it to work when they could. And thanks for convincing me to submit a ticket with CS. I thought for sure I was doing something wrong, or Kraken just could not power two of these pumps at the same time.

But most of all thanks to Hydros CS (especially Michael) for taking care of me & swapping it out with a new one. I never thought in a million years CoralVue would replace something based on a DIY mod not working, and I assumed they'd say no way, we have no idea what that connector is or how you made it. I was a tile contactor. If a customer said to me they want to prep & waterproof their shower, have my company install the tile & guarantee it won't leak, I'd say no way! No company would ever do that!

I swear these pumps were working fine with my first two connectors until my wife said she heard gurgling coming from the tank the next morning. I came down to find the on, off behavior from both pumps. I wonder what happened that night? We have a whole home generator, it did not come on, our clocks did not need reset, power did not go out. Who knows? I just pray it doesn't happen again.

This whole ordeal caused me a ton of frustration and questioning dropping 6K+ on Hydros. I got very discouraged. Now I am gung-ho to get my X4/XP8, X10, and 3 Soles for AWC added to the collective!

 

[KenS]

6+ hrs, still going.

 

[KenS]

Happy to report the new Kraken is doing what it is supposed to! No issues running both 7.0 pumps for +24 hrs now.

If it keeps chugging along I'd consider buying another one for tank side of the wall to power my lights (three XR15's & 4 AI Blades). It should power all of those with the same barrel connector adapter I used to run my Versa 4-bank doser, hopefully. Can anyone confirm?

 

[KenS]

Well, it seems my cheers and excitement came far too soon. Below is a copy/paste of an email I just sent to Michael at CV support. Quite shocking and amazing, really. Screenshots attached too. I literally just got done getting out ALL my bricks and hooking it all back up to the power strip yet again!

Michael, I now have a seemingly catastrophic failure with the new Kraken. I am absolutely beside myself, jaw on the floor. I literally have no clue what to say, except the level of disappointment and frustration with Hydros is off the charts like it has never been before. I mean this thing worked like a charm for literally close to 36 hours. And Boom. Nothing. Dead. Finished!

THANK GOD I was home. Or I'd be looking at everything in my tank dead!

I got my frozen fish food from the fridge. I opened the app and turned off my skimmer pump (Varios 4) and turned off my UV. The plan was to dose some MB7 after feeding, thus off with the skim/UV. I am feeding the tank, and I start to hear gurgling. I go to the fish room and Launch, Kraken and X3 are all black, no lights. NOTHING working. See the attached pictures. I unplugged everything, checked the GFI, tripped it and turned it back on. Plug everything back in. The only thing that will power on is Launch. I scrambled to get all my bricks out once again for the Sicce pumps, skimmer, UV, Versa's. Unreal.

I am assuming the collective is broken because the dead Kraken is in the collective and it is breaking communication between X3 and Launch. I don't know where to go from here as I cannot even connect to the Kraken to remove it.

Please call me Tuesday 1/19 and talk me through how I can remove the Kraken an get the collective between Launch and X3 up and running to get my sensors back.

Was the "new" Kraken unit you sent me a truly NEW unit? Or was it a refirb/return? I suspect a return because it didn't come with the new box/packaging. It was in bubble wrap in a plain cardboard box. I really don't know where to turn from here except ask for a refund. I mean, I want the damn thing to WORK! But this level of failure is scary. I mean it shut off EVERYTHING, including the Inkbird. Very scary man! I am taking a step back from Hydros and I need to reevaluate where I go from here. I have close to SEVEN THOUSAND DOLLARS in Hydros equipment. But I do not want to install it on my tank if it will kill TEN THOUSAND DOLLARS of livestock.

 

[johnadouglas]

Ken, while I don't work for Coralvue/Hydros I'm really sorry for the trouble you're having. I also have thousands invested in livestock and automation including Hydros, and anytime something fails I re-evaluate my setup, my vendors, and myself.

A few suggestions, and others please chime in these are only suggestions.

1. Determine what has actually failed. To confirm, the Meanwell is not plugged into a Hydros power port I assume - but if it is try it on a dedicated power line. Try plugging your old Kraken *just* back into the spare Meanwell power cable to see if it powers on? If it does *not* then the Meanwell has either failed or a breaker blew perhaps? If it does, then the Kraken is potentially the issue (also I do not see a battery plugged into the Kraken, that would also be a good test).

2. Regardless of the results of (1), I would shut everything down and re-wire the CB and termination so that the X3 is directly connected to the Launch, and the Kraken is not on the bus. Then bring it back up to see if the X3 is functional when connected to the Launch. While your collective will report as *broken* you will at least (potentially) be able to see the X3. I recall having successfully removed equipment from a broken collective without that equipment being connected - however if that equipment comes back online on it's own you will need to propagate changes to it as well (after the fact).

Again I'm sorry for your difficulty - I hope Coralvue can help you - FWIW I have (so far) had very good luck with both Krakens.

 

[KenS]

John, that means a lot right now. While CV has been responsive & very willing to help, one thing I have not heard from them is, "We are sorry this is happening", so thanks for that.

CV put a $700 hold on my credit card when they sent the new Kraken until they got the old one back, so I boxed it up & shipped it back yesterday. I no longer have it.

Before the tank even arrived, I hired a licensed electrical company to install a whole home generator & run 3 separate 4-gang circuits (each with GFI) to different areas of the sump room. When this event happened last night, my first thought was the GFI tripped. I unplugged all Hydros equipment & checked the GFI. It was not tripped. I intentionally tripped it to reset it. I went to the electrical box, the breaker was not tripped. I went back and plugged all hydros equipment back in and the only thing that will power on is Launch.

The only thing I did was go to the app, turn off my UV (which is plugged into the Launch) and turned off my skimmer pump which is a Varios 4 plugged into Kraken. That's it! Within 10 seconds of doing that, catastrophic Kraken failure.

I am so thankful I was here or this would have been a disaster as the Inkbird, which was plugged into Launch, was off, as well as the Launch itself. It is now on a power strip with everything else as my trust level with Hydros is at an all time low.

The LFS where I got the tank & who did the install convinced me to not use any control. He said use a refractometer, test your water, do it just like you did it 30 years ago. This is my second large tank, first one I set up in the early 90's & had it 15 years, no control. He said they are a rabbit hole & you'll spend more time fiddling & maintaining the control & that will take away a lot of time from enjoying the tank. About a year after I set up this tank I decided to go all in on Hydros.

And right now, I feel like a complete fool.

 

[KenS]

Does Kraken have a fuse inside of it maybe?

 

[KenS]

John, to answer your question about what the Kraken/Meanwell is plugged into. It has always been plugged in directly to a receptacle, NOT plugged into the Launch. It has always been plugged in directly to its own power source. This was a well thought out and well planned project. Sump is plumbed through a wall behind the tank very near the floor drain. I had my water heater tank moved to a different spot because it was in the way when I planned out the sump room. Three 4-gang GFI outlets, one to the left of the sump, one to the right, and another about 4ft away were installed as well as the whole home gen. I just checked the panel again. No breakers tripped. I just plugged in the Meanwell/Kraken and it is deader than a doornail.

 

[johnadouglas]

Ken - good question re the fuse - Michael was very responsive with me as well - I'm sure he can answer that for you.

Do *not* feel like a complete fool - this is not easy stuff - and while I appreciate the simplicity of the world I had with tanks 30 years ago the truth is vacations and business trips were a *real* challenge - never mind having time for the family. In my case I either embrace automation or I cannot participate in the hobby. If this were easy everyone would be doing it. People come to my house and they are amazed at the tanks, but many would never embrace it once they understand the work and complexity (with or without automation).

I'm getting you put a lot of work/thought into this - do you by chance have a voltmeter to just check whether the Meanwell is providing power when not plugged into the Kraken?

 

[KenS]

I have these electrical tools here now. I know how to use the small pen, I do not know how to use the meter. If you could tell me which setting the meter goes to I assume I could plug in the Meanwell/Kraken then unplug the output on the mean well and put red to red and black to black?

 

[KenS]

See video. I'm not an electrician. Maybe this makes sense.

 

[johnadouglas]

I would keep everything unplugged (power off, disconnect Kraken) until hooked up to be safe and of course be very careful with the probes when the Meanwell is powered up. See the setting I use on my Multimeter - that setting measures AC and DC voltage (Big V with a dotted line and a straight line above it), then yes red to red and black to black - it should read +24V (approximately).

 

[KenS]

John thanks for the input. Just got off the phone with Michael. The Kraken and X3 are dead. He suspects a surge through the CB killed both. I plugged in the Meanwell and put the meter to the setting you described. The meter read 0.00 but I also got a spark coming out of the black side when I touched it to the contact so Michael said if I'm getting a spark it is providing power. Is it possible for the meter to read all 0 and get a spark? Obviously, I an not anything close to being an electrician.

I have to run out & I'll try again to get another reading with the meter when I get back. CV is kind enough to send another Kraken unit & try again, but not covering the X3. Talk soon.