Inconsistent alk results

[Harper]

I have been able to watch the unit a couple times in the last days and the pump heads stick from time to time. Last night the fill pump stuck for most of the first fill cycle. I tapped lightly in it and it's freed/started moving. Are we supposed to grease these pump heads out something? If you are in the room when it happens, it is really obvious like a howling sounds of a motor trying to turn over.

 

[BAMatter]

I have been able to watch the unit a couple times in the last days and the pump heads stick from time to time. Last night the fill pump stuck for most of the first fill cycle. I tapped lightly in it and it's freed/started moving. Are we supposed to grease these pump heads out something? If you are in the room when it happens, it is really obvious like a howling sounds of a motor trying to turn over.

How many tests do you/ have you run? Maybe try hitting the unlink tubing a couple times on each pump head…

 

[Harper]

It's the a run count? I got it in early October it's been calibrated and unkinked at least weekly, generally a bit more. It's run at least 2x a day. I have run it 6x and 4x a day at first. I was hoping the issue was a user error thing but I'm thinking it's a mechanical issue with the pump heads now.

 

[BAMatter]

It's the a run count? I got it in early October it's been calibrated and unkinked at least weekly, generally a bit more. It's run at least 2x a day. I have run it 6x and 4x a day at first. I was hoping the issue was a user error thing but I'm thinking it's a mechanical issue with the pump heads now.

Sounds like it. I’d definitely submit a support ticket, probably switch a head out I would imagine if it’s sticking like that.

 

[Matthew Cantu]

I made a little progress. Initially I had the X10 hanging from the top of my stand about 20in above the IV and reagent at the bottom of the stand. All the commercial Alk testers I have seen have the pump heads very close to the reaction chambers. I laid the X10 on the bottom of the stand right next to the IV and reagent. All the tubes are now really short. The feed and drain still reach up and over the sump, so maybe 20". I might build a stand to sit the X10, IV, and reagent at the top of the sump to shorten the feed and drain next.
View attachment 3970

The results below are since the change. It seems more reliable.

date	Time	hydros	mastertronic	Hanna
12/22	21:00	8.79	8.32	8.5
12/23	9:00	9.41
12/23	21:00	9.41	8.9	8.5
12/24	9:00	8.79
12/24	21:00	9.07	8.82	8.5
12/25	9:00	9.24
12/25	21:00	9.18	8.82	8.5
12/26	9:00	9.24

I do need to open a new bottle of Hanna as the current reads low and maybe only 8.5/8.6

Hey, so does this still seem to be working for you having the X10 below both the IV and reagent?
I am really trying to avoid air bubbles in the line and it is driving me crazy, and I am hoping to find a solution.
This unit is for a client too, and I want to know that it will be ok for long periods in between maintenance and recalibration

 

[thom_smith]

Hey, so does this still seem to be working for you having the X10 below both the IV and reagent?
I am really trying to avoid air bubbles in the line and it is driving me crazy, and I am hoping to find a solution.
This unit is for a client too, and I want to know that it will be ok for long periods in between maintenance and recalibration

I have the iV below the X10 with tank sample input and reagent input approximately 3' in different directions. There is a learning curve with X10 as you need to understand how to properly/securely connect the silicon tubing to the pump heads. You kind of need a fair bit of patience and the Goldilocks touch--nut tight enough, but not too tight. More often than not the air leak is right at the input or output pump head. And in my observation, more frequently the reagent line which also has the greatest test impact because of low flow volume, even small air pockets have a significant impact and sometimes difficult to see. Take your time, be careful and double check your connections. If you're using X10 for service accounts, do yourself another huge favor and get a bulk lot of 3/16 barb to 1/4 stem adapters and install them *anyplace* the silicon tubing meets a push-connect fitting otherwise you will NEVER get a good seal. And if you are cutting the tubing on the bottom side of the push-connect in the dosing container or tank, make certain you have a clean cut for a secure connection and good seal. This applies regardless of whether using X10 for alkalinity testing or third-party BRS/Ecotech/Jebao/other doser for major/trace/carbon/whatever. For pH, temperature acclimate and do a full three-point calibration. I prefer calibrating every 6-8 weeks but you can probably safely go longer. Just recognize the longer you go, the greater the probability of drift. There should be no reason why you can't confidently use X10 alkalinity on monthly or bi-monthly service accounts.

 

[Matthew Cantu]

I have the iV below the X10 with tank sample input and reagent input approximately 3' in different directions. There is a learning curve with X10 as you need to understand how to properly/securely connect the silicon tubing to the pump heads. You kind of need a fair bit of patience and the Goldilocks touch--nut tight enough, but not too tight. More often than not the air leak is right at the input or output pump head. And in my observation, more frequently the reagent line which also has the greatest test impact because of low flow volume, even small air pockets have a significant impact and sometimes difficult to see. Take your time, be careful and double check your connections. If you're using X10 for service accounts, do yourself another huge favor and get a bulk lot of 3/16 barb to 1/4 stem adapters and install them *anyplace* the silicon tubing meets a push-connect fitting otherwise you will NEVER get a good seal. And if you are cutting the tubing on the bottom side of the push-connect in the dosing container or tank, make certain you have a clean cut for a secure connection and good seal. This applies regardless of whether using X10 for alkalinity testing or third-party BRS/Ecotech/Jebao/other doser for major/trace/carbon/whatever. For pH, temperature acclimate and do a full three-point calibration. I prefer calibrating every 6-8 weeks but you can probably safely go longer. Just recognize the longer you go, the greater the probability of drift. There should be no reason why you can't confidently use X10 alkalinity on monthly or bi-monthly service accounts.

Thank you very much! This gives me a lot of hope. I do agree. It does seem from you and from someone else I talked to that it does seem like a reliable testing method when everything is right.
I know it may be difficult to say, but do you have any tips on getting the right tightness on the pump? Like once the tightening stops being easy since it is not pushing against anything. How much should I tighten it after? Like will one or two full turns work? Or does it have to be more?
Sorry I know this is not an easy question to answer and I may just have to test it for myself.
But if I tighten it too much does the line begin to be cut and leak? I guess I am asking if it is tightened too much should I cut the end of the line since it may be leaking now?

 

[Harper]

I have watched my x10 several times in the last few weeks and it seems pumps 1, 2, and 4 all struck from time to time. Seems most common when the head is configured as the fill pump and on the first fill. The pump 3 I have kept consistently as the reagent pump and have not observed it sticking. My guess is that it would stick also but not at 3ml/min.

 

[Harper]

Pump head 1 stuck

Normal operation

 

[Danny]

I have watched my x10 several times in the last few weeks and it seems pumps 1, 2, and 4 all struck from time to time. Seems most common when the head is configured as the fill pump and on the first fill. The pump 3 I have kept consistently as the reagent pump and have not observed it sticking. My guess is that it would stick also but not at 3ml/min.

Have you tried setting the flow rate to 75 on the fill and drain pumps. That is what I use on mine and have had no issues.

 

[Harper]

Setting the flow rate to 75 sounds like a great idea. I opened a ticket and their first step is to per the unit down for 10 min. But I think I will power down the entire collective for 10 minutes and change to 75. Let it run for a few days and see if it becomes more stable.

 

[Harper]

So after turning off the entire collective for 10 min. And changing fill/drain from 100/-100 to 75/-75 the X10 and IV have worked perfectly for 2 weeks. My guess is that the fill and drain don't work well at 100ml/min.